Super Smash Bros

If there’s going to be one final patch to buff and nerf some characters, what would you want?

If you all have any ideas, please drop them in the comments, and if they're really good I might add them in as edits. This is a long post, so you can also use command+f/control+f to find a character you want to talk about if I mention them. One more thing, all %s mentioned have not have the 1.2x singles multiplier applied to them, so if the damages seem a bit low that's why. I can go first.

Ok, obvious nerfs to Pika and the Aegis. I honestly still kind of want both of these characters to be top tiers, partially because I just generally like the characters and partially because they help to stop some very annoying characters from being good.

That being said, if Pika's nair could be a frame slower to make it so Nair loops didn't work as long and it wasn't as good OOS, if the effects of Pancaking were lessened a lot, and also if Thunder and Fsmash could do 1% or so less damage, and therefore less knockback, that would be nice. And since his back air is also pretty annoying that can be toned down a tad also, make it a frame or two slower to start and increase it's knock back growth just a tiny bit so it won't combo as long.

And Aegis, Mythra's kill power needs to be toned down. Just like how squirtle can't really kill without Ivysaur or Charizard, Mythra should not be able to kill so easily without Pyra. Just tone down the knockback on a few moves, probably forward smash and neutral b. And if her forward, back, and down air could be made a bit less safe on shield so that she has to space them to not get punished, that's good too. And Pyra? Her foward smash is still just a bit too stupid strong, it kills Mario from center stage at 73%. If the damage on that could be turned down to 18% instead of 20 (this is without the 1.2x singles multiplier), then it would also make it kill 11% later, which is pretty reasonable. If her up b could get similar treatment but to a slightly lesser degree that would be nice too.

Joker and Wolf can probably be nerfed a bit too, although maybe not as much. Right now Joker gets Arsene after taking 77% damage, if that could be upped by 10-15% that would be a nice nerf. And Wolf's back air can probably be a bit weaker, considering it's as strong as a fair few smash attacks. 10 points less KBG would make it kill 16% later, at 121% instead of 105. And maybe the lasers can do 6.5-7% instead of 8%, that would be great.

Rob's down tilt is frame 5 now, making it link into itself worse and a slightly worse poke in neutral. It also has 7-8 BKB instead of 2, which makes it combo for a shorter time but also not set up stuff at high %s.

As for some buffs, I know it's his character design but Pichu dies insultingly early. It's honestly really, really sad how many moves that you didn't even know could kill will kill Pichu at 120%. That same Wolf back air that killed Mario at 105% earlier kills Pichu from center stage at 82%. That's earlier than most smash attacks on middleweights. Even if his weight could be buffed just up to Puff's level, who dies at 88%, that little bit of extra weight would be so nice. Also, if the amount of damage he takes from thunderjolt could be reduced from 0.8% to 0.6%, that would make approaching with it just that bit more viable, and alongside his slightly higher weight he could actually use it in neutral a bit more.

Min Min's up smash is still dumb. It's still frame 8 and can reflect projectiles. A character with such good zoning should not be able to just OOS kill you and reflect projectiles too with such a fast move. It needs to be two frames slower, frame 10 instead. If the dragon's laser could also be toned down, that would be nice, a percentage and a half less of damage and less knockback.

Sheik is insultingly light. She's the 6th lightest character in the game. I know some characters like Sephiroth have strange weights for balancing reasons, but being lighter than Pikachu, Kirby, and Olimar is just insulting. Buff her to Bayo's level please. This won't actually imrprove her living all that much, just enough to make sense and not be annoying. And speaking of Sephiroth, the One Wing damage boost can be decreased to 1.25x from 1.3x, the run speed boost from 1.25x to 1.2x, and the air speed boost from 1.2x to 1.15x. In exchange, he can be a bit heavier too, about Falco's level, so he'll also keep One Wing for longer, and his nair can be frame 7 instead of 9.

This is very short, can Doc's side b stall in the air's like Mario's? And maybe his aerial down B can have a bit less endlag, so that he can use his up B faster afterward and won't fall as much, even just 5-10 frames off the end of a very laggy move?

Ganon is the worst character in the game and has barely been touched since the game came out. He got a buff to his up b recently, a very slight technical change, a buff that made his down smash a bit more consistent, and buffs that made his forward air a bit less landing laggy and his up air a bit safer to use at the ledge. That's it. I would LOVE a full rework, like they literally just patch a new move in to replace his neutral b, but since that's never going to happen, how about we just make him a bit faster? Let's make his ground and air speed 15% faster. His Nair could also be more reliable, it would be a great move if it was just reliable. So, I think there should be a scooping hitbox so it can reliably hit and combo grounded characters. Also, the first hit should be able to reliably connect into the second, so some finagling with the BKB and KBG please. Also if his jab could be a frame faster and have a reflecting hitbox from frames 6-14 that would be nice.

I know that sounded like a lot but even just a couple of these changes would be nice, particularly the nerfs to Pika, Aegis, and ROB, and the buffs to Doc and Ganon. If you have any ideas please put them in the comments, and if they're really good I'll add them in as edits.


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